{"id":543,"date":"2019-10-08T14:08:58","date_gmt":"2019-10-08T19:08:58","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/?p=543"},"modified":"2019-10-22T18:41:42","modified_gmt":"2019-10-22T23:41:42","slug":"how-prison-crushes-ex-offenders-with-debt","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/2019\/10\/08\/how-prison-crushes-ex-offenders-with-debt\/","title":{"rendered":"How Prison Crushes Ex-Offenders With Debt"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Prison makes it nearly impossible to hold onto savings and earn money. But it&#8217;s a great place to take on debt.<\/p>\n<p>Creditors don&#8217;t push pause while someone&#8217;s incarcerated. And because many people don&#8217;t have the money for lawyers or bail, those costs turn into debt owed to family and friends after release.<\/p>\n<p>In Marc Wilson&#8217;s case, he had assets and plenty of savings before his seven-year prison sentence for drug trafficking began. By the time he was released in March 2019, he had nothing \u2014 except around $50,000 in delinquent child support.<\/p>\n<h4>Child support debt \u2014 and guilt<\/h4>\n<p>It&#8217;s a sweltering September day outside the George L. Allen, Sr. Courts Building in Dallas. Wilson doesn&#8217;t seem to mind, despite wearing a dress shirt and dark suit pants. He just left a meeting with the mother of his 14-year-old son. They had a sit-down with their child support counselor.<\/p>\n<div id=\"attachment_769\" style=\"max-width:100%;  width: 550px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-769\" src=\"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ.jpg\" alt=\"Marc Wilson stands outside the George L. Allen, Sr. Courts Building in downtown Dallas on Sept. 10, 2019. \/ Photo: Courtney Collins, KERA\" width=\"550\" height=\"550\" srcset=\"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ.jpg 2500w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-150x150.jpg 150w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-300x300.jpg 300w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-768x768.jpg 768w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-1024x1024.jpg 1024w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-110x110.jpg 110w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-1360x1360.jpg 1360w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-800x800.jpg 800w, https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/22\/2019\/10\/Marc_Courthouse_OCA_Prison_SQ-450x450.jpg 450w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 550px) 100vw, 550px\" \/><\/p>\n<p class=\"wp-caption-text\"style=\"max-width:100%;  width: 550px\" >Marc Wilson stands outside the George L. Allen, Sr. Courts Building in downtown Dallas on Sept. 10, 2019. \/ Photo: Courtney Collins, KERA<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<p>It was decided that Wilson wouldn&#8217;t have to pay the child support that stacked up while he was in prison.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;They gave me seven years credit, which came out to about $43,000, $44,000,&#8221; he says.<\/p>\n<p>Wilson&#8217;s relieved because his finances are stretched incredibly thin these days. When he was convicted, his house was foreclosed on. He spent his $20,000 savings on his criminal defense. He was a nurse before prison, but the state revoked his license.<\/p>\n<p>Now he installs cable lines at construction sites and earns less than one-third of his $89,000 per year nursing salary.<\/p>\n<p>He has mixed feelings about the forgiven child support, though.<\/p>\n<p>The financial burden of that $44,000 debt might have crushed him. But the guilt of not paying it is doing the same.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;That&#8217;s what I should have been paying,&#8221; he says. His son&#8217;s life &#8220;would have been a lot better if I was making the money that I was and being able to make that amount, that payment.&#8221;<\/p>\n<div class=\"kerabox boxwidth50\"  style='background:#f5f5f5;'>\n<h6>More about Marc Wilson<\/h6>\n<p>Read, see and hear about how prison will <a href=\"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/2019\/09\/24\/after-prison-personal-wealth-starts-over-at-zero\/\">continue to haunt Wilson&#8217;s efforts to rebuild lost wealth<\/a>, even though he&#8217;s completed his sentence.<\/p>\n<p>Here&#8217;s how Wilson and other ex-offenders&#8217; financial losses from incarceration, compounded by systemic racism, <a href=\"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/2019\/10\/01\/how-prison-steals-wealth-from-future-generations\/\">can inhibit younger family members<\/a> from building wealth.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/\">Explore<\/a> more stories in KERA&#8217;s One Crisis Away: The Price of Prison series.\n<\/div>\n<p>Wilson won&#8217;t get out of this with zero debt. He&#8217;s been out of prison for six months, and until today&#8217;s meeting, his child support payment hadn&#8217;t been adjusted to reflect his new income. So he&#8217;d been paying what he could \u2014 about $150 a month \u2014 but quickly found himself $6,000 behind. He also owes interest on that, <em>and<\/em> he owes interest on the $44,000 that was forgiven. His arrears now total $16,000.<\/p>\n<p>Now, he&#8217;ll have to chip away at that. That&#8217;s in addition to his new monthly payment: 20% of his take-home pay.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;It&#8217;s a little tough, but it&#8217;s OK compared to what I was going to have to pay,&#8221; he says. &#8220;So, I&#8217;m OK. And I know that I&#8217;m supposed to do my part to help my son, anyway.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>Wilson is confident that he can keep up with what he owes now. But if the payment had been set higher, or those seven years of debt hadn&#8217;t been forgiven, it would be a different story.<\/p>\n<p>People who don&#8217;t pay child support can be arrested. In that case, the child loses, the ex-partner loses, and so does the person headed to jail.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;Nobody wins [in that scenario], either, because you still can&#8217;t pay, and now you&#8217;re incarcerated and you lose the job that you had, with the minimal amount of money that you&#8217;re making,&#8221; Wilson says. &#8220;So, nobody wins.&#8221;<\/p>\n<div class=\"kerabox boxwidth100\"  style='background:#f5f5f5;'>\n<h4>VIDEO: &#8216;At first it was hard to talk about prison&#8217;<\/h4>\n<p>&#8220;At first it was kind of hard for me to talk to anybody about prison because of the embarrassment and shame that I feel. But I own the time that I&#8217;ve done. &#8230; Just because you make a mistake doesn&#8217;t meant you have to live in that mistake.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>Wilson shares more about his background, his family and his perspective on moving forward:<\/p>\n<p><iframe loading=\"lazy\" width=\"900\" height=\"506\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/L9DLxSo3E4I?feature=oembed\" frameborder=\"0\" allow=\"accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture\" allowfullscreen><\/iframe><\/p>\n<\/div>\n<h4>How loved ones rack up debt, too<\/h4>\n<p>Child support isn&#8217;t the only debt that can haunt someone after leaving prison. Sometimes it&#8217;s as simple as owing money to loved ones.<\/p>\n<p>Jorge Renaud works with <a href=\"https:\/\/www.latinojustice.org\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Latino Justice<\/a>, a national nonprofit focused on including Latinx voices in the conversation around criminal justice reform. He was also incarcerated for robbery for 27 years.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;You can go however many years you&#8217;re in there, and there&#8217;s nothing at all you can do to accumulate any assets or any wealth,&#8221; he said. &#8220;So when you get out, of course, you&#8217;re dependent on family or friends or whatever social services are still available to you.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>A prison stay is expensive for loved ones on the outside. They&#8217;re putting money in a commissary account for food, extra clothes and phone calls. They&#8217;re planning visits that require time off of work, several tanks of gas and a hotel stay.<\/p>\n<p>&#187; <strong>FOR THE CLASSROOM |<\/strong> <em>Educators \u2014 download a <a href=\"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/2019\/10\/08\/for-teachers-a-lesson-plan-on-prison-and-personal-finance\/\" rel=\"noopener\" target=\"_blank\">lesson plan and worksheet<\/a> to teach students about personal finances and incarceration<\/em><\/p>\n<p>&#8220;They probably don&#8217;t have assets, but what they do is deplete their savings quite a bit. You hear some horror stories around that,&#8221; Renaud said.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;There&#8217;s been entire communities, entire neighborhoods [composed] of people of color who&#8217;ve had generations and generations of men who&#8217;ve been incarcerated and thus have kept those communities in states of perpetual poverty.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>Renaud says he went into prison with no real assets. He came out with even less.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;If you&#8217;re going in \u2014 say, like I did, at 19 years old \u2014 of course I didn&#8217;t have anything,&#8221; he said. &#8220;I had a little rattletrap car that my brother ended up taking. I got out, and I didn&#8217;t have anything to build on.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>And that&#8217;s what is so difficult for Wilson Wilson to reconcile. He <a href=\"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/2019\/09\/24\/after-prison-personal-wealth-starts-over-at-zero\/\"><em>had<\/em><\/a> something to build on \u2014 past tense. And if he&#8217;d never driven drugs across state lines, he&#8217;d still be building.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;I was on the right path to gaining wealth. And I had wealth,&#8221; Wilson said. &#8220;The mistakes \u2014 going to prison \u2014 that was my fault, and my actions alone. So, I mean, what else can you do?&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>Not much, he says, but put one foot in front of the other, saving one dollar at a time.<\/p>\n<hr \/>\n<p><em><strong>NEXT &#187;<\/strong> After serving two years in prison for possession of meth, Toby Savitz found herself in a series of low-paying jobs with no real path forward. She finally kicked the door open after landing a position at a nonprofit that helps ex-offenders like Wilson. But she admits, there aren\u2019t enough jobs like hers to go around. <a href=\"http:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/2019\/10\/15\/is-this-it-most-ex-offenders-can-forget-job-advancement-after-prison\/\">Go to Toby&#8217;s story now<\/a>.<\/em><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Prison is a great place to take on tens of thousands of dollars in debt.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":14,"featured_media":742,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"audio","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[2],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-543","post","type-post","status-publish","format-audio","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-one-crisis-away-price-of-prison","post_format-post-format-audio","byline-courtney-collins"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/543","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/14"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=543"}],"version-history":[{"count":78,"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/543\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":1199,"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/543\/revisions\/1199"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/742"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=543"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=543"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stories.kera.org\/price-of-prison\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=543"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}